Question
QUESTION: I'll try to make this as short as possible. I have a 5 zone system and have never had problems with it. I had some work done at my house by a contractor. Three of the valves in the back yard were moved to better the location. The other two are on the other side of the house in the front. I was told by contractor that he replaced two of the three valves. Trusting all was fine, I tested the system. One of the valves is on all the time no matter what and none of the valves (all 5) will turn on or off from the main unit in the garage as before. I reset the controller in the garage with no luck. I can turn on all stations manually at the valve, so water and pressure is not the problem. On top of this, another valve in the area stuff was moved seems to spew water out of the diaphragm all the time and also one of the sprinkler heads that run on that valve is continuously dribbling water out. What can you make of my mess here? I have had ZERO problems with this system for over 5 years with the exception of the normal broken sprinkler head here and there. I am sorry I cant tell you what electronic controller I have as I am not at home, but it was working fine up til this.

ANSWER: Hey Kipp, I'm going to try to answer each question separately. When you say you tested the system, and one of the valves is on all the time. If by testing the system you mean just turning the water on, but not the controller. There are a number of reasons the valve could stick on. The easiest thing to check, is if the plunger in the solenoid is seating properly.The solenoid should just un-screw from the valve body, and you should see a cylinder(plunger) in the solenoid. Make sure it can move freely up and down in the solenoid, and also make sure there is nothing in the body of the valve blocking it from seating on the hole when you screw it back on. The other thing that could be the problem is that either the diaphram is bad, not installed properly or something is under the diaphram, keeeping it from seating properly. To check your diaphram, on most valves there are screws, that when un-screwed will release the top half of the body from the bottom half, and the diaphram sits between the two halfs. If you take the valve apart, make sure you understand how the diaphram is situated, because on most valves it can only be situated one way. Also, on the top of the valve you will see a spring, make sure you save the spring and put it back on the top of the valve when you put it back together. When you take the diaphram out, check at the bottom of the valve, and make sure there is nothing on the seat(rock, plastic pipe piece, extra pvc glue, etc.) that would keep the diaphram from seating right. If work was done, and they didn't flush the pipe before they installed the valves, something probably got in the valve (valves) and it not seated right. This could also be why the one valve is seeping water all the time. The reason the head is wet all the time(probably the lowest head on that valve) is that the diaphram is either not seating properly, or the screws need to be tightened to not allow the valve to leak out the sides. The valve that is leaking, might be as easy to fix as just tightening the screws so the diaphram doesn't leak anymore.If by saying you tested the system, you meant that you turned on the controller and the one valve stayed on all the time no matter which valve was on the controller, then you probably have a wiring problem. The way the solenoids are wired is fairly simple. Each valve has its own hot wire, and also all valves share a common wire. On the solenoid, you will see two wires coming off each one. One wire from each solenoid will connect to the common wire. The other wire (hot) will run to the other wire not connected to the common wire. It doesn't matter which wire on the solenoid you use, you can use either one for common, or either one for hot.Each solenoid will have one wire running to the common wire, and one wire running to an individual hot wire all its own. If the one valve is running, no matter which valve is turned on, then more than likely they have the common wire mistaken for the hot wire on this valve. Or another problem could be that the wires are shorting out, by the hot wire touching the common wire.If you can't get any of the valves to turn on by the controller, it could be a cut wire. You say none of the valves will turn on or off from the main unit as before. I'm not sure if you mean the same sequence(valve #1 frontyard is now valve # 3) or none of the valves are coming on. If thy're not coming on in the same order, its easy to just switch the wires in the clock from one station to another to get them back in the right sequence. It sounds like you have a lot going on. I hope I've given you enough information to at least start looking for a solution. If it was me I would get the contractor back out there, because he didn't do the job right. If you have any more questions,or more information for me, feel free to keep asking them. Thanks and have a great day!



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QUESTION: What a great response! FYI: Contractor is MIA, not too happy about this? I am new to this stuff so bare with me. What I am most perplexed about is that ALL the stations/ valves wont work, even the ones in the front that he did not mess with? You are correct about my testing all stations without the controller and just at each valve to see that there was water and pressure. I turned the valve water off at the one that is running all the time and checked the other four for water and pressure and all of them worked fine that way.

I have Rain Bird 100DV-F 1" valves and an Irritrol SlimDial 6 valve indoor controller. I just tried to remove all the screws off one of the valves to pull it apart and it does not want to budge and I did not want to force it too much not knowing what to expect, what do you say about that?

I would think that a cut wire would not be the case (total guess) as the contractor was in there recently and I would think he would have looked for that?

The valve that was running all the time somehow closed over night with the main water turned off to the system. I turned the main back on and tested that valve and it turned on and would not turn off again now, so I have the main water off to the system again now. This is frustrating and I dont want to spend hundreds of dollars for someone to come out and fix what should not be broken.

If you can recommend what I do step by step, that would be great. Maybe I can tackle this that way, I am pretty mechanically inclined for the most part. Thanks again

ANSWER: Hey Kipp, bear with me also, and respond as much as you want if what I tell you doesn't work. First of all, the Rainbird valve you are talking about is an excellent valve. We use it in about 95% of all our installs. When I was telling you before about checking the plunger in the solenoid, well on this valve the plunger is sealed in the solenoid, so it is a little hard to tell if the solenoid is good or not. I think you are on the right track as far as the valve that is stuck on is concerned. This would be my first starting point. If you have un-done all the screws, if this valve has been in for a few years or more, the diaphram is probably metted to the body. NO problem, if you have to just stick a standard screwdriver between the plastic body, and the diaphram(force it a little bit if you have to) and it will come apart. Just try not to put a hole in the diaphram. One nice thing about this valve, is that when you take it apart, you will notice two little tabs of plastic on the front body of the valve by the solenoid. This will be easy when you put the diaphram back on, because the diaphram has two holes in it that these tabs will go through, that way its easy to tell how the diaphram goes back on.Once you pull the body apart from the valve, the diaphram will either be stuck to the top, or the bottom of the body. Just pull it off either side and look at it and stretch it to see if it has any tears of holes in it. Also look at he seat on the bottom of the valve to make sure it is not cracked or deformed in any way. Also you will notice how the bottom of the diaphram has a thick rubber piece, also check this to make sure this is not pitted or deformed. Also check for any debris that might be down in the valve and clean it out or even crack you main valve just slightly to flush some water through, but hopefully not enough to flood your valve box. When you put the valve back together, turn on the water and see if there is any water coming out the sides of the valve. These screws can be forced pretty tight without stripping them out. Don't be afraid to crank on them. If after doing this the valve still doesn't turn off, I would try switching solenoids from one valve to the next. Let me ask you one more thing before we go on. On this particular valve, there are 2 ways to turn it on manually. One way is to open the bleed screw, and allow the valve to bleed water, and then it will turn on. The other way is to turn the solenoid about a 1/4 turn counter clockwise. Just curious if on this valve the solenoid might not be tightened all the way? Okay, to change solenoids is very simple. The reason you would do this, is if the solenoid is stuck on, the valve would stick on. By changing the solenoid from a good valve to the bad valve, we will be able to tell if the solenoid might be bad. If the valve that won't shut off, shuts off with the new solenoid, then its probably the solenoid is stuck. And visa-versa if the solenoid from the bad valve is put on a good valve and now this valve won't shut off (good valve), its probably a stuck solenoid (bad solenoid). To change the solenoid it just simply un-screws from the body by turning it counter clockwise. As far as the issue with the valves not turning on by the clock goes, this is how I would approach it. First I would check to make sure the controller is actually working. To do this simply turn a station on manually, and if you have a volt ohm meter put the neutral probe on the common screw lead in back of the controller where the field wires go out and the other probe on the station number lead on the hot wire. This should read about 24 volts. If your getting a good reading, the next thing I would check would be the common wire connections. Usually if none of the valves are working, then the common wire is bad some where. If a hot wire is bad, usually only one valve would not work. My feeling is that the common wire runs to one set of valves and then loops from this set of valves to your other set of valves. If this connection at the first set of valves is bad, none of the valves will work. Hopefully this helps you a little more. By all means don't be afraid to do this work yourself. Even if you have to change the whole valve, this is not a hard task, and I can run you through this. Also if you have a hard time determining if the controller is working or not, a lot of irrigtion suppliers would check this for free right at their counter. Let me know how this turns out good luck!

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Irritrol controller   QUESTION: I thank you SO much for your help and time! I tested the controller this morning as my first step. I performed the test as you outlined using a Fluke digital volt meter set to AC. I turned on the #1 station manually and set the ground (black) probe to the "C" (Common) tab on the controller and the hot (red) probe to the #1 station tab on the controller and got nothing. I then took the ground probe and touched one of the two tabs (the one next to the "C" tab)for the AC plug connection on the controller while keeping the red probe to station #1 tab and viola....reads 26.4V? I kept the connections on and turned the #1 station off and about 7-10 seconds later, the volt meter dropped to 5.1V and stayed there. Do you know why I was not getting a reading using the common tab with the ground probe? I did not have time to mess with the valves this morning, but will this afternoon and get back with you. For what it is worth, I have never had a controller problem and all was working great when I turned the system off last November for the winter months. I would estimate that the controller is about 7-8 years old. The connection tabs look Like this on front of the controller, I also attached a picture of the unit: AC / AC / C / MV / 1 / 2 / 3 / 4 / 5 / 6 . my system seems to be using the MV tab as well, but I have no idea where the master valve / pump start might be, but there is a wire coming off of it?

Answer
Hey Kipp, sounds like you might have a master valve hooked up to the system. Let me explain what this is and where it might be. A master valve is normally installed right past where your main water connection for the system is. This valve, if not turned on, will not let any water to the mainline (other valves). The thing about your system, is that you get water to the rest of the valves, because your able to manually operate them. This tells me, #1 either the master valve is stuck on, or #2 you don't have a master valve. To find if you have a master valve, probe, or dig around below where the pipe past the shut off goes into the ground. As far as the controller goes, it sounds like the transformer is fine because your getting a 26.4V reading. The first two terminals Ac/ Ac are where the transformer wires hook in. The C is for the field wire common(s). MV is for the master valve. And 1-6 are the hot wires to each individual valve. The MV terminal will become hot any time any of the valves are turned on, it doesn't matter if it's number 1 or number 6.This way if you do have a master valve, it will turn on and allow water to the other valves. I should back up a little bit. Try checking your voltage on any of your stations, but first un-hook the wires. What I mean is take the wire off C (common), MV (master valve), and numbers 1 through 5. Obviously you need to leave the transformer wires hooked to AC/AC. The other thing to check is in the back by where the wires hook up is there a fuse? To be honest its been awhile since they made this controller, and I can't remember if it had a fuse. With the field wires disconnected try turning on each station individually on the controller, and check your voltage. It could be if something is shorting out in the field, (either the wires or the solenoids) your voltage reading is going to be off. If it reads normally with the wires disconnected, its probably in the field wires or solenoids. If it reads normally with the wires off, hook the common wire back up, and then hook one hot wire at a time (valve # 1 wire first) and try turning valve #1 on and then check your voltage. When you're doing this, leave the master valve wire off. I have a feeling that this wire might have something to do with your problem. After you hook up and check # 1 station, if your voltage reading is good or bad, go to terminal # 2 and hook up that wire and check it out. Keep going down the line 1-5 to see if any of your readings are good or bad. To explain what you did when you tested the system initially. When you touched the red probe to #1 and the ground probe to the common wire, and turned on #1 manually but did not get a reading, this tells me that the controller is not working right, or is shorting out. By disconnecting the field wires, there should be no interference the next time you check it. If you were to put your volt meter probes on AC/AC terminals, you should get a 24 to 27 volt reading. When you touched the black probe to AC with the red probe on # 1 all you were getting was the voltage putting out from the transformer. Another way to check if a valve is working, is to by-pass the controller. To do this, simply touch the common wire to one of the AC terminals, and take a hot field wire ( #1 to #5) to the other AC terminal. This will activate the solenoid in the field. Just be careful not to touch it for too long, because if the solenoid or wires are shorting out, it will cause your transformer to get hot and melt. Probably better to have somebody watching to see if a valve comes on, while you touch the wires to the AC terminals. Hopefully this helps you out. I will check with my supplier to see if this controller takes a fuse. PS. I'm not sure if this takes a 9 volt back up battery, but if it does, take it out as you are doing your testing.Good luck and let me know what happens. Thanks Jim.